Here's the thing we do

[Serinde]

I love Sharon B's Pintangle blog for a host of reasons. This is one of them -- so sensible and, to my mind, true.

Oh, and I'm very tempted to start a SAL here on the forum for 4" disks. Anyone else getting the urge? I've even thought of setting up a larger, say 10", hoop and doing a whole year of stitching, one little bit a day. Perhaps for 2020?

[DahliaDoll]

What a great idea!

[mags]

Ooh very interested

[Mabel Figworthy]

What's a 4" disc? (Well, I know what the words mean, obviously but does it have a particular significance in stitching?)

[Mabel Figworthy]

Oh, and can I raise a slightly dissenting voice? I realise what she means, and in fact DH and I were talking about this recently - when everything was hand-made you tried to get it as regular and perfect as possible, but now that machines can do things so much faster and more regular we try to make it clear that our work is hand-made by including (or at least celebrating the ones that get included unintentionally) imperfections that a machine wouldn't make.

All true. I have had someone say about a certain piece of emrboidery "it's so even, it's like it was made by a machine!" She meant it as a compliment, bless her. So again, I get where she's coming from.

But.

When I do my embroidery, although I will not obsess endlessly about stitches which happen to come out a little uneven if they are not too noticeable, I do try and get it as even and regular and neat and perfect as possible. If that reminds some people of machine work, well, so be it. I just see it as proof that any embroidery a machine can do, a person can do either as well or better (although it may take us much longer than the machine)

So I applaud her wish to make us less anxious about the perfection or otherwise of our stitching - but I take issue with the idea that something which is perfectly executed somehow has less "heart" (one of the comments read: " ‘Hand created’ has a heart and a soul, placed there by its creator’s heart and soul!" - true, but no less true when done without wobbles).

My ha'p'orth - feel free to disagree

[Podolyanka]

May I have a say too? Embroidery /cross stitch is a craft, not art. This is common knowlede, and it suits us. Yet, we try to make our works as close to a piece of art as possible.

Now about her "discs". To begin with, one has to really have lots of time on one's hands.

Secondly, what's the point of creating them? Would you put it up your wall to see it 24/7? I could understand if a teacher at Primary School had nothing to do with her kids and made them sew on buttons, wind threads around some figures, etc. But if she did it again, I would go and see the Headmaster about the objectives of such lessons.

I must be too stupid for this "craft" as I am for "rap" and "punk culture".

[Mabel Figworthy]

Lyudmila, would you be willing to concede that embroidery can be both craft and art - or rather, that it is always a craft, and can be an art? Some of the embroideries I see people create are definitely on a par with someone creating a painting, and if using your paint in an expert way to make a picture is art, then I don't see why using your needle and thread in an expert way to make a picture would not be art.

As for making "useless" things, I'm afraid I'm guilty there . Most of what I stitch is not made into aything useful, I stitch it simply because I enjoy the process of designing and stitching. It is a hobby that I greatly enjoy, whatever it produces. Although as I said earlier I do try to make sure that what I produce is the best I can produce at that time in that technique.

If I personally made such discs for me they would be like doodle cloths, for learning and perfecting stitches, but in a fun way making something decorative out of it. My mind doesn't quite work in such a free-form way (you should see the difference between my embroidery and that of my mother-in-law, who stitch-wise isa much freeer spirit than I am!) but just as I don't generally enjoy abstract art but can appreciate some expressions of it as attractive compositions of shapes and colours, so with this sort of embroidery. But on the whole I will admit I like to see what a picture "is"

[Podolyanka]

Mabel,
I was dwelling on the "discs" alone. They have nothing to do with your embroidery. I agree with you that not all painting is art, and not all embroidery is pure craft.

[Serinde]

Mabel, I think Sharon B's "disk" was simply fabric in a 4"hoop, all filled with interesting and textural stitching. She is very precise with her crazy quilts (not something I would ever do, but I do admire the exuberance of them). What sparked my interest in her blog post was a workshop I attended which basically involved painted silk, angelina fibre (google it, then avoid! Actually it's interesting stuff but gets everywhere), sea shells, etc. The idea was to stitch using the shells and so on. Some of the results were utterly beautiful. I'm not good at that sort of serendipity, so I occasionally challenge myself by working at it, I guess. (Or thinking about it, more like!)

[richardandtracy]

I always shy away from the celebration of something being hand made. It is so often used as an excuse for shoddy and careless workmanship. 'Craft' magazines tend to have a house style promoting quick craft, stuff knocked together in an afternoon. The problem is that it looks exactly like what it is, tat knocked together in an afternoon from rubbish, with no net added value or skill involved.

Furthermore, I avoid the term 'art' like the plague. Post 1900 'Art' has degenerated into the incompetent doodlings of people too lazy to do better. How is an unmade bed 'Art' as Tracy Emmin claims? At Waddeston Manor the building is full of beautiful things, and two portraits by Lucian Freud, that stand out by reason of their poverty of technique and design. Then at the V&A Museum, looking at the silver from centuries past, the skill and workmanship is astounding. And from the 20th century, a bowl wound round a mandrel from wire. If it took more than 10 minutes, the 'artist' was wasting time. The skill involved, negligible.

Embroidery and cross stitch takes time, dedication and skill. Don't demean your own abilities.

Regards,

Richard.

[wendywombat]

So interesting!

My one attempt at this sort of thing was full of 'Wobbly' stitches!! One thing I noticed though, as I stitched and filled in the gaps the 'wobblyness' seemed to disappear and the whole thing looked together.

I just could be tempted to try another
Tempting!